|
Post by Rodneck on Apr 7, 2017 22:02:03 GMT -5
HA HA THE OLD MAN HERE JUST LEARNED HOW TO LIKE YOUR POSTS. Don't do the facebook thing not tech savy at all. Yeah I like that option.
|
|
|
Post by eric on Apr 7, 2017 22:36:20 GMT -5
If that's the case, then it has to be Reed who goes down to learn how to throw strikes. Astin looked really good those 8 seconds we have saw him. Are you guys both drunk already?!! HAHA!! We are 4 games in and you are handwringing over roster decisions that aren't even close to needing to be made. Anyway cheers to that! This team can't afford to lose any games over having no bench. I don't care if it's game one. The reason you field a team is to win. What is the upside of pitching 3 of your best relievers 3 out of 4 of the first 4 games if you have so many options because you are not one turn through? If it's a extra inning game tomorrow and Lorenzen and isglasies is needed, you ok with them pitching 4 out of 5 with 5 more guys in the pen? Because I am not. Not to count you have NO bench.
|
|
|
Post by Rodneck on Apr 8, 2017 0:18:40 GMT -5
Are you guys both drunk already?!! HAHA!! We are 4 games in and you are handwringing over roster decisions that aren't even close to needing to be made. Anyway cheers to that! This team can't afford to lose any games over having no bench. I don't care if it's game one. The reason you field a team is to win. What is the upside of pitching 3 of your best relievers 3 out of 4 of the first 4 games if you have so many options because you are not one turn through? If it's a extra inning game tomorrow and Lorenzen and isglasies is needed, you ok with them pitching 4 out of 5 with 5 more guys in the pen? Because I am not. Not to count you have NO bench. Well we simply disagree here. A tight game in front of us was there to win and we had to take it. As you said you field the team to win and we did. Tomorrow's reality is different and we absolutely cannot use Iglesias after he pitched 2 innings. Lorenzen is only 1 inning removed from an off day for him. My point is these are not going to be your stock 50-60 inning reliever. It is not how they were used last year and won't be this year. Because of their starting background they will be leveraged for more innings and more overall use. Unless they are showing signs of fatigue. 90-100 innings are within their threshold. Since the season just started fatigue is an improbability. The wins were there for the taking and we did. Lacking 1 bench bat is not costing us games. I can't think of a single bat on the roster that is a must. But knowing the greatest weakness of the team is the rotation keeping 2 starters in the pen for the potential blowup start or extra innings and inserting 1 or both of the 2 into that game will save more extreme overuse of all the pen. If early wins are on the table the risk vs reward is acceptable IMO. Besides I was just joking around with you two with the drinking schpiel!
|
|
|
Post by redsfan4life on Apr 8, 2017 7:10:59 GMT -5
I hate the 4 man bench. Hell I hate the 5 man bench. I am old enough to remember 7 men bench with only 4 sp 5 bull pen guys and a swing man. The swing man being used to start double headers or long stretches with no off days. I remember Reds and Cubs 3 game series from the 70s when Bruce Sutter pitched 4 inns first game came back very next day and pitched 3 inn. and came back 3rd day and threw a inn. Pitchers are babied from little league on up. I believe all this summertime and in alot of cases playing well into the fall with these travling teams is what is hurting all these young arms.
If you had a son who was good enough to be on these travling teams would you want him at age 12-18 be playing from march- Oct? No way would I want this. A friend of mine has a son age 13 who does this. He travles as far away as South Carolina to play. He is not a kid who pitches much. He is so good of a SS and power hitter he don't pitch much. But many many young kids do. They of course limit inns for the kids from the age they start pitching to the majors. Now years ago kids played spring into early summer and that was it. Major leaguers bull pen gus pitched as many as 4-5 straight days. But once season was over most never picked up a ball till spring training. I dont know the answers but I know there is far more injures today than there was years ago. Either that or guys back than just pitched with hurt arms/elbows and kept there mouth shut.
Back to the original point about benches. We in my earliest rememberance the 70s teams carried 10 pitches. But before that it was 9. Then sometime in the 80s or early 90s went to 11. 2000s went to 12. Now it is 13 for at least half of the teams. And within the next 2-3 mark my words every single team will carry 13 pitches and 4 men benches. Either mlb has to do 1 of 3 things 1. add a 26 man to the rosters for every game not just the rainout double headers and specify each team must carry only 13 pitchers and 13 hitters. 2. Dh will be in both leagues. It is not that bad on A.L. teams to carry 3 extra hitters when the pitcher isn't in the lineup. All they need is a extra c and extra IFer and Ofer. 3. teams will have at least two bench guys who can play both IF. and OF. plus at least one good hitting reliever who can play in the OF as well as pitch. One of these things IMO will happen.
|
|
|
Post by eric on Apr 8, 2017 9:28:50 GMT -5
This team can't afford to lose any games over having no bench. I don't care if it's game one. The reason you field a team is to win. What is the upside of pitching 3 of your best relievers 3 out of 4 of the first 4 games if you have so many options because you are not one turn through? If it's a extra inning game tomorrow and Lorenzen and isglasies is needed, you ok with them pitching 4 out of 5 with 5 more guys in the pen? Because I am not. Not to count you have NO bench. Well we simply disagree here. A tight game in front of us was there to win and we had to take it. As you said you field the team to win and we did. Tomorrow's reality is different and we absolutely cannot use Iglesias after he pitched 2 innings. Lorenzen is only 1 inning removed from an off day for him. My point is these are not going to be your stock 50-60 inning reliever. It is not how they were used last year and won't be this year. Because of their starting background they will be leveraged for more innings and more overall use. Unless they are showing signs of fatigue. 90-100 innings are within their threshold. Since the season just started fatigue is an improbability. The wins were there for the taking and we did. Lacking 1 bench bat is not costing us games. I can't think of a single bat on the roster that is a must. But knowing the greatest weakness of the team is the rotation keeping 2 starters in the pen for the potential blowup start or extra innings and inserting 1 or both of the 2 into that game will save more extreme overuse of all the pen. If early wins are on the table the risk vs reward is acceptable IMO. Besides I was just joking around with you two with the drinking schpiel! I wasn't being shitty about it. It may have came off that way though. I just hate not having enough help off the bench, and the manager deciding to not use the entire pen. Just as you said agree to disagree.
|
|
|
Post by brad on Apr 8, 2017 10:02:49 GMT -5
I hate the 4 man bench. Hell I hate the 5 man bench. I am old enough to remember 7 men bench with only 4 sp 5 bull pen guys and a swing man. The swing man being used to start double headers or long stretches with no off days. I remember Reds and Cubs 3 game series from the 70s when Bruce Sutter pitched 4 inns first game came back very next day and pitched 3 inn. and came back 3rd day and threw a inn. Pitchers are babied from little league on up. I believe all this summertime and in alot of cases playing well into the fall with these travling teams is what is hurting all these young arms. If you had a son who was good enough to be on these travling teams would you want him at age 12-18 be playing from march- Oct? No way would I want this. A friend of mine has a son age 13 who does this. He travles as far away as South Carolina to play. He is not a kid who pitches much. He is so good of a SS and power hitter he don't pitch much. But many many young kids do. They of course limit inns for the kids from the age they start pitching to the majors. Now years ago kids played spring into early summer and that was it. Major leaguers bull pen gus pitched as many as 4-5 straight days. But once season was over most never picked up a ball till spring training. I dont know the answers but I know there is far more injures today than there was years ago. Either that or guys back than just pitched with hurt arms/elbows and kept there mouth shut. Back to the original point about benches. We in my earliest rememberance the 70s teams carried 10 pitches. But before that it was 9. Then sometime in the 80s or early 90s went to 11. 2000s went to 12. Now it is 13 for at least half of the teams. And within the next 2-3 mark my words every single team will carry 13 pitches and 4 men benches. Either mlb has to do 1 of 3 things 1. add a 26 man to the rosters for every game not just the rainout double headers and specify each team must carry only 13 pitchers and 13 hitters. 2. Dh will be in both leagues. It is not that bad on A.L. teams to carry 3 extra hitters when the pitcher isn't in the lineup. All they need is a extra c and extra IFer and Ofer. 3. teams will have at least two bench guys who can play both IF. and OF. plus at least one good hitting reliever who can play in the OF as well as pitch. One of these things IMO will happen. Then, I'm sure you're going to love to hear the fact Daytona is going to roll with a 6-man rotation at least initially to start the year. These some extra factors in plays, as only 2 guys spent all of last year in the rotation. Jonathan Crawford pitched very, very few innings due to injuries; Cuban signee Vladimir Gutierrez didn't pitch at all; and Jose Lopez/Wendolyn Bautista each split time between the rotation & bullpen. There's some stretching out and inning limits in play, but yeah...a 6 man rotation
|
|
|
Post by eric on Apr 8, 2017 17:45:51 GMT -5
I am so glad that we have yo yo and Stephenson hadn't pitched in two weeks and Astin had to go down because of Arroyo presence. And pitchers still have to pinch hit.
FANTASTIC!
|
|
|
Post by redsfan4life on Apr 8, 2017 19:31:22 GMT -5
handed them game today with the lineup and yo-yo. now on crappy Feldman to win series.
|
|
|
Post by redsfan4life on Apr 8, 2017 19:35:32 GMT -5
Never understood why they can't just rest one starter at a time. Nope we rest 3 or 4 in same game. Just saying here Cardinals take this game it's yours. As soon as you get excited about this team they do stupid shit like this. Bad enough Arroyo pitching. I get maybe one Vet inns. eater but we had that in Feldman. That wasn't enough so lets put 50 year old yo-yo in rotation two.
|
|
|
Post by clinz on Apr 8, 2017 20:19:53 GMT -5
I hope the experiment with Yo Yo is over. What have we gained here? Did we learn anything new? I thought one of the reasons we traded Phillips was to keep a player from blocking a younger one. Then the next day we sign Yo Yo. I'd rather see the young guys get a shot. I can live with growing pains but this is just an unwarranted pain. Then what was the crap with resting multiple players today. It's the 5th game of the year. I thought were trying to win games here. I hope this isn't a pattern. Quit playing the nice guy. Look what happened when they played nice guy. Bad contracts and holding onto friends (players) to long.
|
|
|
Post by Rodneck on Apr 8, 2017 21:19:31 GMT -5
Never understood why they can't just rest one starter at a time. Nope we rest 3 or 4 in same game. Just saying here Cardinals take this game it's yours. As soon as you get excited about this team they do stupid shit like this. Bad enough Arroyo pitching. I get maybe one Vet inns. eater but we had that in Feldman. That wasn't enough so lets put 50 year old yo-yo in rotation two. Arroyo, Stephenson, and Reed cannot be in the rotation. The latter two have walked 10 batters in 4 innings. Davis couldn't get 3 innings. I give him another start. What do you do with the last rotation spot? Romano? Yeah he replaced 3 starters. I had the game taped and as soon as I saw that I said "L".
|
|
|
Post by Rodneck on Apr 8, 2017 21:26:33 GMT -5
I hope the experiment with Yo Yo is over. What have we gained here? Did we learn anything new? I thought one of the reasons we traded Phillips was to keep a player from blocking a younger one. Then the next day we sign Yo Yo. I'd rather see the young guys get a shot. I can live with growing pains but this is just an unwarranted pain. Then what was the crap with resting multiple players today. It's the 5th game of the year. I thought were trying to win games here. I hope this isn't a pattern. Quit playing the nice guy. Look what happened when they played nice guy. Bad contracts and holding onto friends (players) to long. I would put Reed into the rotation and send Stephenson down. Finnegan, Feldman, Garrett, Reed, and Davis. Yo gotta go. Less velocity, less control, more bombs. Today was pathetic. The team walked 12 batters. The starting 8 today was pure stupidity. They haven't even gotten into a groove and you rest 3 fuckin starters? I can understand keeping an 8 man pen and a short bench when your rotation is so volatile. Resting 3 position players in 1 game, wow...
|
|
|
Post by eric on Apr 8, 2017 22:57:34 GMT -5
Cody reed has sucked both outings. Stephenson hadn't pitched since I was a baby.
No.
|
|
|
Post by Rodneck on Apr 9, 2017 7:38:41 GMT -5
Cody reed has sucked both outings. Stephenson hadn't pitched since I was a baby. No. Well what do you do Eric? That is my point. We don't have an endless stream of options. We are going to have to live with some of these guys. Who is in your rotation? I have been anti Stephenson since the offseason. That leaves us with Reed or Romano. I don't want to see Arroyo or Adelman either. Castillo is in AA. You don't like anybody and I don't much either. That's the problem. But other than getting another bench player and not using our best bullpen pitchers I'm not hearing a lot of solution ideas out of you. What is your roster as opposed to what we have now? And I'm not sittin here toe tapping waiting to shoot whatever you say down. We knew we had a rotation problem. I think 5 games in we give everybody a few starts except Stephenson.
|
|
|
Post by eric on Apr 9, 2017 10:31:02 GMT -5
Cody reed has sucked both outings. Stephenson hadn't pitched since I was a baby. No. Well what do you do Eric? That is my point. We don't have an endless stream of options. We are going to have to live with some of these guys. Who is in your rotation? I have been anti Stephenson since the offseason. That leaves us with Reed or Romano. I don't want to see Arroyo or Adelman either. Castillo is in AA. You don't like anybody and I don't much either. That's the problem. But other than getting another bench player and not using our best bullpen pitchers I'm not hearing a lot of solution ideas out of you. What is your roster as opposed to what we have now? And I'm not sittin here toe tapping waiting to shoot whatever you say down. We knew we had a rotation problem. I think 5 games in we give everybody a few starts except Stephenson. Yesterday marked two weeks since Stephenson had pitched. What did you expect him to do Rod? That's been being my point. You are right, we don't have a lot of options. But the ones we do have, let's use all of them to at least try and keep them somewhat sharp. You can't sit a starting pitcher for two weeks, bring him in, in a relief role and expect any other outcome than what we just got. Reed and Stephenson had about the same shitty numbers last season. So far we have saw two innings 4 walks from Reed. Sending Stephenson down after one outing, in relief, doesn't help. I don't have the exact answer right now of what to do. Because we haven't seen enough of anybody but isglasies and Lorenzen to get a idea of how to make a judgment.
|
|