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Post by Rodneck on Aug 7, 2017 14:31:30 GMT -5
I still can't believe we gave 100 million dollars to Homer Bailey and not Johnny Cueto. This really is an epic fail! Dug out the notebook to do a comparison check. On 5/22/17 our Reds were 8th in runs pacing 803 runs. Now we are 19th in runs pacing 730 runs. The bullpen had a 3.38 ERA and were 8th also. Now they are at 4.23 and 16th. The defense is the only thing positive remaining. They have an identical .987 FPCT which is 4th. So in the 67 games between then and now the Reds have scored 4.20 runs a game which is a pace of 682 runs. Basically the starting pitching not only gassed the pen and drove up their ERA by nearly a full run but it taxed the morale of this team and they unconsciously have quit for the most part. It's a sad reality and one that will not be fixed if left unattended. If they are not active in the offseason my level of interest come next April will be severely damaged. They say there is a plan in place. Good. An empty ballpark and disgusted fans are what you have right now. Plan that shit! Other than Bailey the pitching was pretty solid. The pen allowed way too many baserunners but were decent. This was a winnable series. The offense took the weekend off.   |
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Post by flaredleg on Aug 7, 2017 23:21:47 GMT -5
Paying Bailey over Cueto still haunts me. For the record, I was for keeping Cueto over Bailey all along. Cueto was an Ace, Bailey never will be, a #3 at best.
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Post by Rodneck on Aug 8, 2017 13:09:25 GMT -5
Paying Bailey over Cueto still haunts me. For the record, I was for keeping Cueto over Bailey all along. Cueto was an Ace, Bailey never will be, a #3 at best. Yeah it was an abuse of sabermetrics. He was paid for peripherals, the no hitters, and 2nd half ERA IMO. Not the body of work. Cueto should have been kept. 2 of the 3 we have left are not playing or underperforming in the minors. Right now that whole trade is a bust. Bad decision. |
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Post by redsfan4life on Aug 8, 2017 18:38:36 GMT -5
I think Homer was kept all along because he is white. If Homer hadn't been kept the Leake would have been. Cueto was third on the list.
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Post by redsfan4life on Aug 8, 2017 18:41:10 GMT -5
That Cueto trade was a bust but Chapman trade we really got took on that one. Rookie Davis I doubt will ever be back in the big leagues.
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Post by flaredleg on Aug 8, 2017 23:19:28 GMT -5
I can't remember a trade in the last 10 years where we got a sizable better deal, we usually get fleeced. The Latos trades (trading for and trading him away) seemed to be very good deals, but that's all I can think of. Brian, I recall you being the president of the Latos fan club.  |
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Post by brad on Aug 9, 2017 1:03:10 GMT -5
Eugenio Suarez for Alfredo Simon looks pretty good. Long Term I think Castillo for Straily will look good too.
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Post by Rodneck on Aug 9, 2017 10:35:31 GMT -5
I guess what bothers me most is never developing a starter since Cueto and Bailey. Those were picks of other GM's. Leake because he went straight to the majors we didn't have to do anything with. Harang and Arroyo were from other organizations. In fact have we developed any player period that wasn't from a former regime or another team? I guess Frazier and Leake are it. That's all I can think of off the top of my head. That's why I am not buying "The Plan". Senzel and Winker look like they will develop into useful lineup players but other than Castillo, maybe Mahle, we have a lot to do in the interim. If the plan is wait til players develop=puke.
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Post by redsfan4life on Aug 9, 2017 13:28:07 GMT -5
I would trade Hunter Greene if he would net a solid cost control number 2-3 ish type starter. One who is already in the big leagues with a track record. I have zero faith in Greene not being messed up or injured by the time he makes it to majors. Down the road it may turn out to be a awful trade but I would take that chance.
Call me crazy but if they trade for a solid starter and sign another solid starter. I am not talking crazy money on the signing. But if they would do those two things have two guys to go along with Castillo they could compete next year. With three reliable starters. Surely they would have enough holdover starting pitchers for two guys to emerge to fill out a decent middle of the pack type rotation.
Also Price lets Castillo throw over a 100 pitches last two times out. Castillo should be handeled with kid gloves rest of year. We are last place team no matter how much he pitches. So why risk your poetinal ace down the road in a lost season. He pulls a nobody like Adelman the other night in the 5th inn. but IMO lets Castillo throw too many pitches. Because he is trying to save his job by winning as many games as possible. Therefore he is not doing what's best for future of this team. His ASS needs to go now. Why wait till end of season? The Reds managment either needs to tell him he has a job next year no matter how many games they lose this year or fire him now. I don't trust him or any of the minor league coaches to handle young pitchers.
They need to clean house on at least half of the coaches in the system.
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Post by redsfan4life on Aug 9, 2017 13:38:08 GMT -5
I been on the Jesse Winker bandwagon for a long time. I knew he would show power when given the chance to play. Today we are facing a lefthander Travis Wood. Of course idiot Price puts Kivelhan in RF. Most likely Kivelhan won't even be here next year even if he is he is nothing more than a average to below average bench player.
Winker may not be able to handle Left hand pitching. But we will never know if he isn't given a chance. Why not give him a chance in a season that is lost?
Again it's Price trying to save his job with wins. It is not about wins right now it's about sorting stuff out like can Winker hit Left handers. We know what Kivelhan is bench warmer at best. We need to see what Winker can do he has a future.
Winker,Votto and Castillo and to a degree Romano and Stephenson are only reasons I am watching now.
Also Scooter sucks against Left hand pitching. Ever since he was named starter he has tanked like his baseball card says he would. I like Scooter but we know what he is. A very good bench player and a guy you can start 2-3 times a week. He should not be starting ever against a LHP. Nor should he be starting over Peraza on a last place team. I am not a Peraza fan but you have to let him play see what you have got. He has played better of late. You can't give up on him yet. We know what Scooter can do he has had eboungh years in majors to show what he is.
Sorry about long rant guys but these things piss me off.
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Post by Rodneck on Aug 10, 2017 10:20:59 GMT -5
I would trade Hunter Greene if he would net a solid cost control number 2-3 ish type starter. One who is already in the big leagues with a track record. I have zero faith in Greene not being messed up or injured by the time he makes it to majors. Down the road it may turn out to be a awful trade but I would take that chance. Call me crazy but if they trade for a solid starter and sign another solid starter. I am not talking crazy money on the signing. But if they would do those two things have two guys to go along with Castillo they could compete next year. With three reliable starters. Surely they would have enough holdover starting pitchers for two guys to emerge to fill out a decent middle of the pack type rotation. Also Price lets Castillo throw over a 100 pitches last two times out. Castillo should be handeled with kid gloves rest of year. We are last place team no matter how much he pitches. So why risk your poetinal ace down the road in a lost season. He pulls a nobody like Adelman the other night in the 5th inn. but IMO lets Castillo throw too many pitches. Because he is trying to save his job by winning as many games as possible. Therefore he is not doing what's best for future of this team. His ASS needs to go now. Why wait till end of season? The Reds managment either needs to tell him he has a job next year no matter how many games they lose this year or fire him now. I don't trust him or any of the minor league coaches to handle young pitchers. They need to clean house on at least half of the coaches in the system. I've noticed the bottom part also. They won't call a white pitcher up from AA or let him go 110 pitches but they'll do both with a Latino player. IMO they end up better developed pitchers whereas the former end up a mess. We have seen it. |
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Post by Rodneck on Aug 10, 2017 10:23:11 GMT -5
I been on the Jesse Winker bandwagon for a long time. I knew he would show power when given the chance to play. Today we are facing a lefthander Travis Wood. Of course idiot Price puts Kivelhan in RF. Most likely Kivelhan won't even be here next year even if he is he is nothing more than a average to below average bench player. Winker may not be able to handle Left hand pitching. But we will never know if he isn't given a chance. Why not give him a chance in a season that is lost? Again it's Price trying to save his job with wins. It is not about wins right now it's about sorting stuff out like can Winker hit Left handers. We know what Kivelhan is bench warmer at best. We need to see what Winker can do he has a future. Winker,Votto and Castillo and to a degree Romano and Stephenson are only reasons I am watching now. Also Scooter sucks against Left hand pitching. Ever since he was named starter he has tanked like his baseball card says he would. I like Scooter but we know what he is. A very good bench player and a guy you can start 2-3 times a week. He should not be starting ever against a LHP. Nor should he be starting over Peraza on a last place team. I am not a Peraza fan but you have to let him play see what you have got. He has played better of late. You can't give up on him yet. We know what Scooter can do he has had eboungh years in majors to show what he is. Sorry about long rant guys but these things piss me off. I heard Doug from redsminorleagues piss and moan about Schebler not being able to hit lefties but he has this year. The next argument will be sample size. But my argument will be that until later in the 20's I don't think any of these players are finished products no matter what hints you get from the stats. Let em play and reality will tell you what's up. |
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Post by starscreamlive on Aug 12, 2017 9:35:55 GMT -5
I think Homer was kept all along because he is white. If Homer hadn't been kept the Leake would have been. Cueto was third on the list. Marge hasn't been in control of this team in decades, yet some things are hard to change. |
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Post by starscreamlive on Aug 12, 2017 9:46:40 GMT -5
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